MotorStorm

[Chriswsm]

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xyccxy wrote:

Without religion, the world would be such a better!

They should make a game where all OVER religous poeple turn into zombies or something!

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We don't need a game for that.  Religion has been turning people into Zombies for thousands of years in real life using the following process:

• Capture person of weak will such as a child, drug user, depressed, poor, lonely, mentally challenged.
• Convince them of some ridiculous deity
• Convince them that YOUR and only YOUR little religious text was written by this deity
• Tell them that their soul depends on obeying this text and their interpretation of the rules within but nonetheless tell them to overlook rules such as selling your daughter into slavery and wanting someone else's Ox, because some of the rules are more correct than others.
• Despite the discrepancy with the rules the deity that supposedly wrote them is said to be infallible.
• Convince them that he/she/it made us in his/her/its own image.  Which displays lack of imagination, laziness and vanity.  
• Advise them to breed whilst ignoring the fact that humanity is heavily overpopulated and still climbing at 2.5/second. 
• Make their children part of your religious cult.
• Get them to do your bidding and fiddle with their kiddies (using an instrument similar to a violin of course)

[Cyborg___Ninja]

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xyccxy wrote:

Without religion, the world would be such a better!

They should make a game where all OVER religous poeple turn into zombies or something!

But really, can anyone tell me what has religion done to benefit us?

Message Edited by xyccxy on 20-10-2008 09:31 AM

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ooh lets see now how about education for the masses, medical care for the masses for free, feeding the poor and also clothing them, battling diseases pro-actively, mother theresa springs to mind as does gandhi, i could go on but you get the point.

[TheWildWhelk]

Bravo Sir, for trying to crack the giant block of religion that is dragging society back into the middle ages! One word that needs to be shouted as loudly as possible is RATIONALISM. I would rather believe in The Flying Spaghetti Monster than some actual 'invisible man in the sky who sent down his angel with 300 or 600 wings/Only Son' nonsense! Ladies and gentlemen, we are living in the 2st century, not the first century AD! Anyone who genuinely believes that a deity of some sort (the obvious insert-name One True God garbage) is actually able to hear the thoughts and feelins of billions of people, is in serious need of either a wake up call, or clinical treatment for being delusional.

Copies of The God Delusion available from all good bookshops and online. It should be DEFACTO required reading in faith schools.

Message Edited by TheWildWhelk on 20-10-2008 11:39 AM

[Kettlefish]

I'm sorry when did fictional stories from the past become "law"?

Er.....hmmmm, any chance you could explain the role of the bible, 10 commandments etc then?

Sony should have simply withdrew the game in the purely Islamic countries, why? As that is where the product is most likely to be offensive. The rest of the worlds countries are all goverened by other religions and rules etc... Are those countries religious laws any less important? Is the western right to freedom of speech any less important?

what about the the huge populations of Muslims in every other country in the world?  I agree that every other religion was the right to have it's views respected, I don't think that's in doubt, and I hold freedom of speech in very high regard but in my opinion that applies to everyone on the planet, not just western cultures.

True it doesn't mean however that our religios icons can be used in this way, society has eroded such that its seen as ok to do so. If a song was called Jesus is my ***** would that not be offensive? Does the Jewish population not find South Park's constant insults offensive?

I don't believe I said it was OK to erode any religious icons signifigance, and I personally would never do such.  As far as South Park goes, this is something I have a little experience of as well.  Yes some members of the jewish community are offended by it, without doubt.  But some arn't, the reason for which seems to be that they see it not as an insult to them, but rather a critique of the people who come out with it.  You'd be amazed the thing's you talk about when recording people for 8 hours a day, several weeks in a row. 

It doesn't matter? It's the same argument, like I said if I wrote a sonmg about Jesus being my crack ***** that would be offensive!

It depends. If it was about jesus of nazareth (sorry if that's the wrong title) yes,  but Jesus is a common name in some parts of the world.  Also the song doesn't say that.  It's called Jesus built my hotrod, you're taking it beyond the meaning of the track.  What if that reference is about someones faith in jesus to give them the spiritual strength and ability to perform such a task.  I'd say that's a pretty good endorsement.  In one of your first posts you said said you were offended because Jesus wasn't a greesemonkey he was a carpenter.  Does the song actually claim that Jesus was? or are you just assuming that?  have you asked to song's writer the meaning of the words?  Every religious reference is not automatically intended to cause offence.  But reciting the Qu'ran to music does, to every Muslim, in the world because they believe it makes their prayer less meaningfull.  I'm sorry I don't believe it's the same argument.

They are abiding by the rules of my home. Just as I would expect them to abide by the rules of the country they are in. How many European controls are controlled by Islamic Law?

Sorry but there may but a slight misunderstanding here.  My comments on smoking are in support of sony's decision.  i.e.  If someone asked me not to smoke in their home I wouldn't, just like as an entire culture of people have asked that I don't recite the Qu'ran to music so I won't.  But if they said I couldn't come into the house because I'm a smoker (I'm not, that bit is hypothetical), I'd find that unreasonable, just like if anyone (muslim, hindu, christian, buddist, etc) said I wasn't allowed to have an opinion on their religion, I'd also find that unreasonable.

This is about sensitivity to all people.  You can't have blanket rules telling you want is and isn't OK.  Lets not get this confused with law.  No country to my knowledge in Europe is governed by a set of religious laws.  Each country has it's own common law.  But that doesn't mean we can't be sensitive to peoples views.  If you say to make it fair, you make it OK to use any religious icon, term, whatever, in the name of freedom of speech, you offend people, possibly even constituting a breach of their rights.  If you say it's not OK to use any religious icons, terms, whatever you then limit other peoples right freedom of speech and expression, yet again possibly constituting a breach of their rights.  It's not a black and white issue, it's not pandering to islam, it's not making the christian and catholic churches any less important.  It's about sensitvity to ALL people.  You can't make things fair by overcompensating in the opposite direction cause that makes thing's even more unfair.

If you are offended by the ministry track, that's OK.  And I will support your right to question the motives of the song.  But to fuel this discussion with "if it's OK for them, it's OK for me" type arguments doesn't help the issue.  That's how wars get started.  I'm sure if you approach sony they will treat your views with the same sensitivity they give to others, what's wrong with that?  have you approached sony? if so what was their response, or have you just came here?

LOL, So say we all is a Naval expression and nothing to do with religion. It's used on Battlestar as it is a fictional "naval" fleet.

If it is a naval expression then forgive me, as I was unaware of that.  But it is not used in that context on battlestar, from the battlestar wiki: "The phrase "So say we all (listen • help • info)" is a concluding response to prayer in the Colonial faith. "  It IS used in a religious context on the show.  Which illustrates the point that it is easy to make assumptions, and get things wrong, which I believe may be happening to the wider religious debate that we are currently undergoing.

Phew, sorry about the long post everyone, I've said my peice and that's it for me, I recognise that everyone has thier own opinion, and believe I've gotten mine across.  I love games. LBP is gonna rock, Motorstorm is gonna rock, and that's what I care about, I think the issues raised here are valid, but possibly to the detriment of the games industry which is a shame.  I just want to drive, shoot, fly, jump overthings, create, and generally enjoy myself on my console.

Hey Tux, bit of a thorny one this, I new I should have stayed out of it, oh well.

Peace and goodwill to ALL lifeforms on this very fragile little yet quite big planet, we call earth.

[DiscoDa]

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tokke100 wrote:

I was waiting for a thread like this...

If sony doesn't do what is asked... you can go to court and win this... just on the fact of religious discrimination, and the fact that christianity is the biggest religion on the planet

(ps sorry for my bad english, i'm dutch)

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I find this Dutch person offensive.

I demand he be removed.

[alzrnb]

Great Idea, do that, cos Sony will F***ing love you for it

Remember how well Resistance did once they officially ***** off the Christians (York Cathedral)????????

Please do this, it will make the game a lot more popular and give us more online opponents

[Chriswsm]

Manchester Cathedral rather than York I think (unless somehow they are the same place).  That game was already out and an apology was made and it all died down. 

In this situation the game is being recalled and reprinted so all the blue-ray disks that were being used originally are being wasted.  As an environmentalist I find deliberate waste offensive.  They should have released it and patched it to placate the believers in a unproven deity.

They should have gone with the logic.  Released the game, patched the game, apologised to any Mali speaking Muslims that may have heard the song in the meantime.  (Yes the song was in the Mali language according to BBC news.  Apparantly not even many Muslims speak Mali.)

No waste, lower cost, release date unchanged

vs

Lots of waste, higher costs, release date changed, majority of customers annoyed

And I agree with the OP all they way in respect of the fact that people fear offending Muslims but don't give a monkeys if they offend other religions or logical individuals.

[andyrome64]

Being a member of the Amish denomination I am offended by the fact that motorstorm promotes the use of motor vehicles and I therefore demand that all vehicle categories in MS be changed to the following:

- Horseback with saddle

- Horseback without saddle

- Big elephant two seater cabin

- Donkey mudplugger

- Santa's Reindeer

Please remove all references to gas-burning air-polluting devil-bourne machines in this game. Thanks.

Message Edited by andyrome64 on 20-10-2008 03:26 PM

[No46_TheDoctor]

I'm off to watch Monty Pythons, The Life Of Brian.

And as for the clever people saying you can take sony to court over this, I don't remember anyone taking the makers of Life Of Brian to court, it was banned from some cinemas, and still is i think.

You lot are giving Christians a VERY bad name, with all your holier than thou crap, but then again from my experience with "Christians" I expect nothing less, I have nothing against Christ, just you lot who claim to represent him, idiots.

Message Edited by No46_TheDoctor on 20-10-2008 05:49 PM

Lets get one thing straight here, Sony don't give a ***** about offending Muslims, they just don't want their premises petrol bombed or worse, big difference there.

Message Edited by No46_TheDoctor on 20-10-2008 05:51 PM

[Chriswsm]

Yes they are not the messiahs they are all very naughty boys