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16 Aug 2012
By fenian

fenian

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Assange Asylum

18 Replies 398 Views Created 16-08-2012

So Ecuador has granted Assange asylum on the grounds that his human rights were breeched.

 

Do you think the police should go in to get him, do you think they should arrest him if he leaves in a diplomatic car?

 

I don't think they should. I dont think anyone should enter the British or Irish embassys to arresst someone we granted asylum or enter our cars with diplomats. I think its a disgrace if they forcefully remove someone from Ecuador territory who has been granted asylum on human rights grounds.

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T-e-X

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amen
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fenian wrote:

So Ecuador has granted Assange asylum on the grounds that his human rights were breeched.

 

Do you think the police should go in to get him, do you think they should arrest him if he leaves in a diplomatic car?

 

I don't think they should. I dont think anyone should enter the British or Irish embassys to arresst someone we granted asylum or enter our cars with diplomats. I think its a disgrace if they forcefully remove someone from Ecuador territory who has been granted asylum on human rights grounds.



Agreed. :Argh: That would just be wrong.

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InfiniteStates

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In this case, no, but you can't state that that will be the case always.

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hydra25

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If it's like Arkham Asylum I'll get it.
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I still haven't completed that game.
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fenian wrote:

So Ecuador has granted Assange asylum on the grounds that his human rights were breeched.

 

Do you think the police should go in to get him, do you think they should arrest him if he leaves in a diplomatic car?

 

I don't think they should. I dont think anyone should enter the British or Irish embassys to arresst someone we granted asylum or enter our cars with diplomats. I think its a disgrace if they forcefully remove someone from Ecuador territory who has been granted asylum on human rights grounds.



But it isn't Ecuadorian territory, which is why the UK are legally allowed to enter either the car or the Embassy building to make an arrest. The security and staff in the car and the embassy building would have no power to stop the British police from entering and making an arrest, they would be required by UK law to abide to UK law which would instruct them to step aside as the arrest is made.

 

Do I agree with them arresting him? Not really, America just seems to be framing him so that he is extradited.

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[ Edited ]

 


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Kermit1970

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So the Americans posted all their dirt laundry on his site without his knowledge, did they?
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ProjectVRD wrote:


But it isn't Ecuadorian territory, which is why the UK are legally allowed to enter either the car or the Embassy building to make an arrest. The security and staff in the car and the embassy building would have no power to stop the British police from entering and making an arrest, they would be required by UK law to abide to UK law which would instruct them to step aside as the arrest is made.

 

Do I agree with them arresting him? Not really, America just seems to be framing him so that he is extradited.


 

It is considered the territory of Equador, they can only Enter if they ignore internaitonal law, they are legally allowed ignore international law in certain cases but this isnt one, this has never been one of the cases you can enter an embassy.

 

As for cars, they are supposed to be immune to law, youre only supposed to bring the law into account on scannded documents or when their feet are on british soil either outside the building or in the airport.

 

What makes you think an embassy is not regarded as the territory of its home nation? Is there some reason why this would be specific to this embassy?

 

*edit - Even russia wont enter an embassy, someone lived in an embassy for 15 years in Russia knowing as soon as they left they would be arrested and Russia even in the bad old days would not enter.

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ProjectVRD

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fenian wrote:

ProjectVRD wrote:


But it isn't Ecuadorian territory, which is why the UK are legally allowed to enter either the car or the Embassy building to make an arrest. The security and staff in the car and the embassy building would have no power to stop the British police from entering and making an arrest, they would be required by UK law to abide to UK law which would instruct them to step aside as the arrest is made.

 

Do I agree with them arresting him? Not really, America just seems to be framing him so that he is extradited.


 

It is considered the territory of Equador, they can only Enter if they ignore internaitonal law, they are legally allowed ignore international law in certain cases but this isnt one, this has never been one of the cases you can enter an embassy.

 

As for cars, they are supposed to be immune to law, youre only supposed to bring the law into account on scannded documents or when their feet are on british soil either outside the building or in the airport.

 

What makes you think an embassy is not regarded as the territory of its home nation? Is there some reason why this would be specific to this embassy?

 

*edit - Even russia wont enter an embassy, someone lived in an embassy for 15 years in Russia knowing as soon as they left they would be arrested and Russia even in the bad old days would not enter.



That is not strictly true, the UK have granted Ecuador the building and will abide by agreements not to enter, but at any time the UK is legally allowed through both UK and International law to withdraw that agreement with Ecuador at any time and with immediate effect as it is still UK land and under jurisdication of the UK law.

 

It happens quite often where we hear one country asks another to leave and vacate an embassy. Russia (or USSR) most likely felt that one particular person was not worth souring relations further with the nation at question. The UK is not in a similar position, they have the world's only super power and one of the largest trading partner's breathing down their neck to get Assange, not to mention Assange also published information that annoyed British politicians. Behind the scene's we would probably find that most nations are pushing the UK to do this, so in context souring relations with Ecuador is the logical solution by revoking their embassy and moving in.

 

There is no such thing as diplomatic immunity as far as the immunity is concerned, no matter who the figure is, they can and will be arrested if the political will deems it to least disruptive course of action. This is why the UK government have said they are going to move in and arrest him and while doing so no laws will be broken.

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[ Edited ]

 


I am going to be rude and ask you follow me 


@TweetScientific


 


If I had my own way then you wouldn't have a choice


But you will find out about some ridiculously awesome stuff,


Like QUANTUM TELEVISIONS!!!!


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I think they should extradite him as soon as possible. If that means entering the embassy so be it. I think he should face his alleged crimes and defend his innocence. There probably is international pressure to extradite him but I can't shrug the feeling he might actually be guilty of the assault charges. It would be wrong to let a criminal go.
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It's interesting that the rape claims came to light shortly after he ***** America off.

 

He is more than willing to stand trial via video link, but the Sweedish authorities rejected his request.

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WJB1 wrote:

It's interesting that the rape claims came to light shortly after he ***** America off.

 

He is more than willing to stand trial via video link, but the Sweedish authorities rejected his request.


It's also interesting that several messages on the victims twitter accounts, boasting about spending the night with Assange and hanging out with him, were deleted shortly after the media caught on to the story.

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TonightWeRide2.jpg

http://socialclub.rockstargames.com/crew/people_of_the_honey

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I'm surprised that they haven't picked him off by now

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ProjectVRD wrote:

That is not strictly true, the UK have granted Ecuador the building and will abide by agreements not to enter, but at any time the UK is legally allowed through both UK and International law to withdraw that agreement with Ecuador at any time and with immediate effect as it is still UK land and under jurisdication of the UK law.


 

It is classed as Equador territory, they are not under UK law. Like I said its illegal for the UK to enter and take him out. 

 

Your scenario of them rescinding the embassy to arrest him, has no historical merit, it has never been done before. Every time an embassy has had its rights taken away every one in the embassy has been driven to the airport in convoy to leave and not arrested. The only time in history people have went into an embassy to arrest someone is when there is a warrant out for them.

 

Henry Kissinger visited the UK without having a french warrant acted on, but this guy is getting sent out of the country with no warrant, no evidence, no charges, just to answer some questions he could answer on phone.

 

No matter what rights you think the UK has to go in, Every other country in the world has the same rights to go into British embassies but never do. Im sure lots of countries do want you to go in and arrest them, so Iran, Russia, China, India, Pakistan, Syria can start doing the same and going into embassy of small countries they know cant hurt them because they want questions answered.

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No-one should be safe from the law. Send James Bond in to blow it all to bits.
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fenian wrote:

ProjectVRD wrote:

That is not strictly true, the UK have granted Ecuador the building and will abide by agreements not to enter, but at any time the UK is legally allowed through both UK and International law to withdraw that agreement with Ecuador at any time and with immediate effect as it is still UK land and under jurisdication of the UK law.


 

It is classed as Equador territory, they are not under UK law. Like I said its illegal for the UK to enter and take him out. 

 

Your scenario of them rescinding the embassy to arrest him, has no historical merit, it has never been done before. Every time an embassy has had its rights taken away every one in the embassy has been driven to the airport in convoy to leave and not arrested. The only time in history people have went into an embassy to arrest someone is when there is a warrant out for them.

 

Henry Kissinger visited the UK without having a french warrant acted on, but this guy is getting sent out of the country with no warrant, no evidence, no charges, just to answer some questions he could answer on phone.

 

No matter what rights you think the UK has to go in, Every other country in the world has the same rights to go into British embassies but never do. Im sure lots of countries do want you to go in and arrest them, so Iran, Russia, China, India, Pakistan, Syria can start doing the same and going into embassy of small countries they know cant hurt them because they want questions answered.



No it is not. We will leave it at that.

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[ Edited ]

 


I am going to be rude and ask you follow me 


@TweetScientific


 


If I had my own way then you wouldn't have a choice


But you will find out about some ridiculously awesome stuff,


Like QUANTUM TELEVISIONS!!!!


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hey hey

http://untreaty.un.org/ilc/texts/instruments/english/conventions/9_1_1961.pdf

 

Article 41
1.Without prejudice to their privileges and immunities, it is the duty of all persons enjoying such
privileges and immunities to respect the laws and regulations of the receiving State. They also have a duty not to interfere in the internal affairs of that State.

 

The Embassy is protected and exempt from search of prosecution etc.  However Diplomats must still obey and respect local laws as well as laws of their own country.

 

Julian Assange is abusing the "Diplomatic immunity privileges as well as breaching the Vienna Convention because he is doing it specifically to negate extradition

 

Diplomatic privileges are there to protect visitors working in this country carrying out official duties. Immunity isn't there to circumvent the law

Wether or not I believe the accusation to be genuine or some kind of tinfoil hat style plot by the US government is a moot point.   An accusation has been made and Mr Assange should face the charge and either acquit himself are be held responsible for a crime. 

 

 

 

 

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fenian wrote:

 

Your scenario of them rescinding the embassy to arrest him, has no historical merit, it has never been done before. Every time an embassy has had its rights taken away every one in the embassy has been driven to the airport in convoy to leave and not arrested. The only time in history people have went into an embassy to arrest someone is when there is a warrant out for them.

 



Isn't an extradition order effectively the same as an arrest warrant? It seems that we do have the legal power to revoke the dilomatic status of the embassy, but we'd have to be prepared for our officials to be ejected from Ecuador pretty quickly and there would be much nervous rattling of port decanters at the Foreign Office.

 

Anyway, I expect they'll find a way to smuggle him out of the country under the shield of diplomatic immunity sooner or later.

 

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