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29 Mar 2018
By teramoto_pd

teramoto_pd

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Regarding penalty judgements

604 Replies 31,065 Views Created 29-03-2018
29 Mar 2018
By teramoto_pd

Hi Everyone,

 

The penalty judgements have been updated in the last update.

 

https://www.gran-turismo.com/world/gtsport/news/00_4814515.html

 

- Depending on the player's network environment, the communications time lag (where a car's position moves or wavers momentarily) was creating a large increase in collision speed, even when it only appeared to be a slight/mild collision incident to the player . As a result, the penalty judgement system was overreacting to these incidents. We have now adjusted the penalty judgement standard to alleviate this issue.


- Reduction of the additional time penalties applied when a time penalty is ignored.

 

- Collisions between players with DR A or higher apply a penalty to both players involved, but we will be adding a fault adjustment to this time penalty.

 

- If a car pushes another car into a wall, the penalty applied to the player of the car that caused the incident will now be more severe;

 

- In a collision between two cars, the car behind will no longer receive a more severe penalty;

 

- A Time Penalty will no longer be applied to cars spinning out of control;

 

- No penalties for collisions will be applied while a Time Penalty is counting down. (*In a future update, we plan to make cars under such condition semi-transparent);

 

- Cars over a lap behind will now be ghosted depending on the distance from the player's car.

 


We apologize for the overly strict penalty judgement this had caused.

 

The penalty system will continue to be improved, so if you find judgement in certain situations that you do not find justified, it would be great if you could report it on this thread.
It will be easier to evaluate when is a movie attached, so when you make a report please attack a replay movie if you can.
(Please try using limited publication links on Youtube)

 

The current penalty judgments take into account the following:

 

- The Penalty Judgement system monitors the on-track conditions for some time after a contact/collision, and determines a penalty after seeing the resulting conditions of the drivers involved after the collision.

 

Please note that the severity of the penalty judgment differs / increases depending on your DR.

 


The following improvements to the penalty system is planned for the future:

 

- Improvements to penalty judgments when network lag is occurring.
- Notification of penalty information for both parties involved in an incident.

 

Please look forward to further improvements in the future for more precise incident and penalty judgments.

Thank you.

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Xamot

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"Surely if the front of an opponents car hits your door mid-corner, there is no way this can be the fault of the lead car?"

 

Not necessarily. If the trailing car had an overlap on the straight leading into the turn, then the inside corner actually belongs to the trailing driver and they are obligated to the exit line up to a car's width at the edge of the track.

Only if there is no overlap is the outside leading driver obligated to the apex of the turn. In this situation, the trailing driver should receive a greater penalty if he even touches the leading driver.

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Beccosinho

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It was the latter and yet they ended up with no penalty at all, so I needed to stop before the line and they just wizzed past for the win. They apologised after, acknowledging it was their fault in the first place...

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I call it discrimination. Dont worry, slightly mad stuidos have a new console coming out soon called mad box as in madness engine in a box. They found a gap in console market where both sony and xbox are ignoring us customers and stealing out money. The only sport left in gt sport is a sport where penaltys are the only sport lol  seems as i see some harsh updates online i think my comment is very polite and very kind hahaha lol  

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Ronin_GThayc

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I think this is a great step in the right direction,it means that I'm not goin to lose all the points I've gained in other races.

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Thank you for the additional details @teramoto_pd! Let's see how the new system works on track. Only issues I had with the 1.14 system were the 1-2 second penalties for contact so minor that you couldn't even notice it and the increasing penalties when you had 5 seconds or more which caused people to slam their brakes on the racing line, which in turn caused more penalties and so on.

 

In addition to the penalty system, it would be very interesting to read about the BoP process as well. What are the goals, what data is used to determine nerfs or boosts and how fuel consumption is taken account (I believe you know about the case of Gr4 BMW M4 already as it was nerfed quite heavily in 1.15). I think the BoP has improved along the way but there are still quite a few cars that on higher skill levels stand no chance on barely any track, especially when fuel and tyre wear is enabled. I mean for example, has anyone seen a Peugeot RCZ Gr.3 after it was nerfed a while back?

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grga84

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Last night my DR points droped 24000 becouse two trols.

Both of them started hiting me and other players as soon as race started. they both ended DNF but i hawe none satisfaction as my DR droped from A to C.

One month ago same thing happened.

I am seriusly thinking of selling this game and stop my misery.

gts.png

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steviea712

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Same thing happened to me last night, so frustrating after weeks of work trying to build up my DR!!

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el-ve

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“- A Time Penalty will no longer be applied to cars spinning out of control”

 

is this just Sport Mode then? because I got a 29 secs penalty for spinning out at Bathurst in a lobby race last night

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Mr_Tibblez

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Holy frell, 29 seconds penalty for one incident? 

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Yeah, accidentally went on the grass at conrod to let someone through and spun off at the chicane bit, went quite far off track

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leandromorb

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Hi there,

 

I wrote some ideas about how to improve the great SR system already and also a new mode (My coach) which would help to form new drivers based on top existent players.

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mrddevil

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the penalty system is not right on the moment. 

i just have done a FIA race and they pusht me a lot of times of track, the total penalty time was almost 14 second for me. 

after 8 rounds i was ***** of that i pusht the guy off track that was pushing me all the time. 

when the race was finisht i saw that my SR was downgraded from SR A to SR E.

it takes alot of time to come to A but it cost only 1 race to go to E. 

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grga84

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Like litlle kids wrote penalty algorithm...

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phewitt21

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Maybe it’s me but I’ve just started the daily race with the Red Bull X14 junior or whatever it’s called, standing start into the first corner I go from 4th to 3rd but come out of the first s bend with 4 seconds of penalties... I haven’t touched anyone or been touched.... I get knocked off the track half way round and pick up another 2 seconds.   So forgive me if I am not seeing any changes at all in the penalty judgements.   

 

One thing PD should do is stop penalizing players who quit out, I went from 4th to 18th - same race but earlier today after being knocked off track agin by no braking retards.   The game offered me no protection but quite happy to penalize me for being knocked off the track or for when I quit because don’t want to battle back to finish no where.

 

Plus Polyphony - yours comms to the community are the worst I’ve come across from any developer on any platform.... ever.  

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Fear not theres a new console coming out :) plus the only sport left in gt sport is a sport where penaltys are the sport. I really wish there was a achievement based on penaltys as it would be completed by actually not aiming to complete it. I call the penaltys and lack of care discrimination. Also we made pd 7 billion on profits so where exactly is our money showing as i dont see it. Also gt1 cars are back in 2020  like old gt one etc? Well toyota  mclaren, koeinsegg, aston martin etc are making gtp cars fully road car based gt1 with 1000bhp hybrids. Guess who gets them first? Project cars gets them first :) 

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SvennoJ

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The 1.15 update has made the penalty system worse in imo. I do a lot of sport races, always save the footage and sifted through it to make a compilation of all the penalties I received since 1.15 on Monza and Yamagiwa + Miyabi..
I'm by no means perfect, yet I feel many of these penalties were undeserved or unnecessary.


Also please fix exiting the pit overlapping with another car. It's in the second clip of the video, merged with another car, no control over steering and we both slam into the wall. Put a few feet distance between cars after a pit stop.

It's not all worse, as there were also instances where I got hit from behind and did not get a penalty (not in the video) However I feel like I still get SR points deducted for that even without SR Down showing on the screen as I sometimes end up with a red rating together with a clean race bonus...

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S2N-Ava

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You will find that the 2nd clip penalty is totally deserved.

 

Just so you should know...  Traffic coming out of the Pits are not supposed to cross the white line into the line of fast moving traffic...  The white line is there for Safety.  You can only move to the Racing Line when the white line ends...

 

Sorry, you were at fault....  Not the only time you crossed the line on coming out of a Pit Stop.

 

 

Ava

 

 

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Mr_Tibblez

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I am no expert, far from it, but having watched the video my first reaction is the system looks harsh but fair. Granted, there was maybe a handful where I thought it was odd (especially the first two and the stacked pit exit), but the majority of the penalties you either go off track or touch competitors. I think perhaps a few you get done for brake-checking or trying to block too late. Generally speaking, a lot of the penalties seem avoidable, in my opinion it's the result of being overly agressive and lack of spatial awareness. The little radar thing with the arrows is a really good tool, I find it makes it a lot easier to keep track of the competitors.

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SvennoJ

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Look again and read. No control over steering coming out of the pit merged with another car. I was steering right at the time, yet we were both forced into the wall. There was also no penalty issued there and no other traffic apart from the two of us emerging from the pit fused.

Second time where I came out of the pit the car behind me was far enough behind to set me up for the corner. I was braking at the correct time, the car behind made no attempt to brake nor move over to the left. If I had stayed all the way right I would have been unnecessarily slow through the chicane creating a problem for the car behind.

Yet if you want me to make a reel of the other 10 times I came out of the pit and stayed on the right side for traffic, I can...

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S2N-Ava

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I can only go on seeing the video, just looks like driving into the firing line..  But, if you say there was completely no control... I'll take your word.  Maybe a few glitches still in the game, it was just after the update..  and all manner of things are broken.

 

 

I never drove that Daily last night.  Just not worth it... it was always going to be a train of wrecked cars due to the nature of faster moving cars.

 

I tend to choose what Tracks and cars suit me as a driver...  never put a Qualification lap on the board, choosing to start at the back and work through the field.  Find it more satisfying driving up the field, mainly the fuel saving races where you can gain places due to strategy.

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SvennoJ

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You can see the other blue arrow on the radar sticking out a tiny bit on the right under mine. Maybe it's a new thing as it's the first time that happened to me. I've heard of people getting out of the pits while overlapping and getting penalties for it, yet not losing control and veering into the wall as what happened here.

I did that daily 16 times yesterday, 10 with positive SR, 7 with clean race bonus, 6 with negative SR which is where those clips are from. I've completed 157 sport races on Monza, 69 with GR.1, I know the track and how the cars behave there :) I drive all tracks and cars, I'm currently at 2050 sport races finished total.

Making up positions from the back without qualifying is fun, yet you always have to be careful for people not knowing the braking points or the car + track all that well. Which is why penalties served in the middle of the race tend to create more problems. Matchmaking already puts up recipes for trouble at SR.S with S/S to D/S matched together. DR.B and lower get away with bumping, while DR.A and up get severe penalties for the slightest contact. That leads to mixing up the field with faster drivers getting stuck behind slower more erratic drivers after serving penalties. (Which is dangerous mid race anyway)

It would be better if penalties are simply added at the end, or mandatory stop and go in the pits, as well as serving the time during a regular pit stop. I understand the purpose is to give back illegally gained positions, yet from what I've seen since the penalties were added, it's often creating more chaos.

And while on the subject of chaos, PD please stop respawning cars in the middle of the last turn on Big Willow. Every time that happens it takes people by surprise and either brake check someone or they go flying off trying to avoid. Resetting cars on the driving line is always disruptive.

I'm not a fan of fuel saving myself, especially not on Mount Panorama and Nurb 24. It's hard to pass on those tracks and a slow car that did not pit, easily creates a traffic jam in bad parts of the track. Many times have I carefully slowed down behind a fuel saver to wait for a good moment to pass only to get hit by traffic backing up behind.

One last thing. I just got taken out by a laggy 1 bar connection. Please PD ghost cars with lag. I see it happen every day that a 1 bar connection shoots off and takes out one or more cars. They get taken out themselves as well as on their side all the other cars brake too late. Which also makes me question whether the server has anything to do with penalties as I've received penalties from laggy cars with a message they got the penalty as well. However after the race they don't have any red dot and claim we never made contact.

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